This past Sunday, my pastor recounted an invocation given in the Kansas State Legislature on January 23, 1996. Pastor Joe Wright of the Central Christian Church in Topeka, Kansas offered a simple, heartfelt prayer and a controversy erupted. One legislator got up and walked out, others protested, and phones at the state house and Pastor Wright’s church rang off the hook. You may have read it before, but it bares repeating. Sadly it is more appropriate today than ever.
We have continued to let our values slip away. We stopped mentioning God, stopped teaching the Bible, stopped valuing life, stopped expected people to have personal responsibility. And as our values have eroded, as we have slipped farther away from God as a nation, so too have our freedoms faded away. We have replaced Jesus Christ with a government and a President, and not surprisingly lost our way.
We need this prayer today. Not for Kansas, not in a local church, but throughout our nation. Contrary to our President’s past comments, we are a Christian nation. Now more than ever, we need to remember that. Many of us who want to take our country back and kick the government out of our lives feel helpless against the march of greater government and massive debt… we feel helpless that our representatives don’t listen to us… we feel helpless that our nation is lost.
Our nation has lost its way, but it is not lost. We are not helpless. We must have hope, not in a phony politician, but in the one true God. And as that hope strengthens us, we must keep working, keep writing, keep calling, stay active and make our voices heard. This is our nation, and through the grace of God we can take it back.
The Prayer:
Heavenly Father, we come before You today to ask Your forgiveness and seek Your direction and guidance. We know Your Word says, “Woe to those who call evil good,” but that’s exactly what we have done.
We have lost our spiritual equilibrium and inverted our values.
We confess that we have ridiculed the absolute truth of Your Word and called it moral pluralism.
We have worshiped other gods and called it multiculturalism.
We have endorsed perversion and called it an alternative lifestyle.
We have exploited the poor and called it the lottery.
We have neglected the needy and called it self-preservation.
We have rewarded laziness and called it welfare.
We have killed our unborn and called it choice.
We have shot abortionists and called it justifiable.
We have neglected to discipline our children and called it building self-esteem.
We have abused power and called it political savvy.
We have coveted our neighbors’ possessions and called it ambition.
We have polluted the air with profanity and pornography and called it freedom of expression.
We have ridiculed the time-honored values of our forefathers and called it enlightenment.
Search us, O God, and know our hearts today. Try us and see if there be some wicked way in us. Cleanse us from every sin and set us free.
Guide and bless these men and women who have been sent here by the people of Kansas, and who have been ordained by You, to govern this great state. Grant them Your wisdom to rule and may their decisions direct us to the center of Your will. I ask it in the name of Your Son, the Living Savior, Jesus Christ.
Amen
No related posts.
“Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.”
I think even Jesus agreed with the concept of the separation of church and state. Who are you to deny Jesus’ words?
What? That passage means to follow the law and pay your taxes. The above post does not deny Jesus’ words.
Furthermore, what I have said is NOT contrary to a “separation of church and state”. It might be contrary to your understanding of such, but your understanding then is clearly wrong. I have never advocated for the government to merge with the church. I am not advocating that the government control the church. I AM advocating that our nation return to its founding, that of a Christian nation that respects Free Will and Personal Responsibility. Even Thomas Jefferson, the man who first penned the words “separation of church and state,” believed our nation was a Christian nation and our government should reflect such.
Is a Christian Nation kind of like an Islamic Republic, only different?
I have no aspirations to remove the faith that some nation might have been founded upon. Iran wants to be an Islamic Republic, fine. I have no quarrels with their or any other country’s stated religion. If the state IS the religion, that is a different story. If the state chooses to stone people who don’t follow their religion, that is a different story. If the state strives to kill nonbelievers, that is a different story.
John, I thought you were a serious thinker. Misguided, yes, but a thinker nonetheless. Yet your recent responses, just like your first have been nothing short of troll-worthy. If you are not going to participate in an intellectually honest debate, then you are adding nothing to the conversation.
intellectual dishonesty? a troll? I just asked a fair question.
Your response indicated to me that the line between Church and State in a Christian nation might be defined by Americans tolerance of non-Christian people of faith (or no faith) in so much as we don’t kill them. I’m not aware of what SPECIFIC distinctions you draw beyond that. That is to say, I’m not all that clear on what you mean when you define the US as a Christian Nation.
What makes me uncomfortable about the tone of Pastor Joe Wright’s prayer is a the claim of knowledge of a divine province on behalf a particular political agenda. I believe his offering of the prayer in the Kansas Legislature violated the spirit and letter of the 1st Amendment, which was designed by our founders to protect our freedom of religion.
America is a Nation of Laws. Perhaps you are suggesting we should be a nation of Christian laws? In such a case, on whose interpretation of the Bible should we base our laws? Or perhaps you are saying something quite different? But again, I don’t have any clear understanding of what you mean.
I am left thinking of singular images like Bill O’Reilly annual rant about the War on Christmas, an Alabama judge waging a crusade to have the 10 Commandments displayed at a Courthouse, or Tom Delay’s horrible exploitation of Terry Schaivo’s death. Maybe that’s patently unfair, but I am not at all comfortable with what changes people may be seeking from governance when they choose to define the US as a Christian Nation. So enlighten me …
And please … no more teasing me with faint praise only to take it away in the next sentence. It’s just cruel
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“Even Thomas Jefferson, the man who first penned the words “separation of church and state,” believed our nation was a Christian nation and our government should reflect such.”
Really? Got a cite for that handy? I realize it’s hard to be sure what somebody “really” thought, especially when they lived over 200 years ago, but everything I’ve read on the subject indicates exactly the opposite. For example, a quick Google search turns up the following:
“Jefferson was just as suspicious of the traditional belief that the Bible is “the inspired word of God.” He rewrote the story of Jesus as told in the New Testament and compiled his own gospel version known as The Jefferson Bible, which eliminated all miracles attributed to Jesus and ended with his burial. The Jeffersonian gospel account contained no resurrection, a twist to the life of Jesus that was considered scandalous to Christians but perfectly sensible to Jefferson’s Deistic mind. In a letter to John Adams, he wrote, “To talk of immaterial existences is to talk of nothings. To say that the human soul, angels, God, are immaterial is to say they are nothings, or that there is no God, no angels, no soul. I cannot reason otherwise” (August 15, 1820). In saying this, Jefferson was merely expressing the widely held Deistic view of his time, which rejected the mysticism of the Bible and relied on natural law and human reason to explain why the world is as it is. Writing to Adams again, Jefferson said, “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter” (April 11, 1823). These were hardly the words of a devout Bible-believer.
Jefferson didn’t just reject the Christian belief that the Bible was “the inspired word of God”; he rejected the Christian system too. In Notes on the State of Virginia, he said of this religion, “There is not one redeeming feature in our superstition of Christianity. It has made one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites” (quoted by newspaper columnist William Edelen, “Politics and Religious Illiteracy,” Truth Seeker, Vol. 121, No. 3, p. 33). Anyone today who would make a statement like this or others we have quoted from Jefferson’s writings would be instantly branded an infidel, yet modern Bible fundamentalists are frantically trying to cast Jefferson in the mold of a Bible believing Christian. They do so, of course, because Jefferson was just too important in the formation of our nation to leave him out if Bible fundamentalists hope to sell their “Christian-nation” claim to the public. Hence, they try to rewrite history to make it appear that men like Thomas Jefferson had intended to build our nation on “biblical principles.” The irony of this situation is that the Christian leaders of Jefferson’s time knew where he stood on “biblical principles,” and they fought desperately, but unsuccessfully, to prevent his election to the presidency. Saul K. Padover’s biography related the bitterness of the opposition that the clergy mounted against Jefferson in the campaign of 1800.”
I’m sure you have a bazilion sources that refute this information, but I just thought I’d put it out there…
Barry, if “everything you’ve read” led you to believe that Jefferson wanted God out of our government, then what you’ve read has been very selective indeed. Maybe you got your information from some liberal professor? I’m not sure.
Regardless, last time I checked Google was a resource, not a “source.” So it would be nice if you would cite the source and not the search engine. Either way, its not good form to paste two lengthy paragraphs here, a link and a few short quotes would do. Please make lengthy arguments those of your own.
In the very letter where Jefferson used the phrase “wall of separation between church and state” Jefferson is not at all complaining about religion or Christianity in our government, he is stating quite clearly that the federal government shall not establish a religion. The letter was in response to Danbury Baptists. The idea was that the federal government was prohibited from *preventing* religious expression or exercise, it was not to remove religion from the government. There is a huge difference between having a government-sponsored religion, and a government that was founded on the ideals of a religion with rights ordained by God. One puts government above God, the other puts God above government. The first is prohibited by our Constitution while the later is clearly how that Constitution was formed. No where does Jefferson state the government should deny its Christian founding. In fact, he even closes the letter with prayers for “the protection and blessing of the Common Father and creator of man.” ( http://www.usconstitution.net/jeffwall.html & http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=123 )
Furthermore, Thomas Jefferson explicitly mentioned God and even Christ on a number of occasions. For a man so often cited for coining the idea of a “separation between church and state,” which many use to try and remove all references of Christianity from our government, don’t you find it surprising that he himself didn’t refrain from doing so?
It is commonly understood that Thomas Jefferson wrote the Declaration of Independence. If God should be out of our government, why was God’s presence so evident in the Declaration? “Nature’s God” is mentioned in the first paragraph, the second paragraph states that all men are “endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights”, and he closes it with “a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence”. If not God, what was he referring to? Certainly the “protection of divine Providence” didn’t refer to a musket and militia. ( http://americanelephant.com/blog/commentary/independence/ )
Many documents of the time referred to the date as “in the year of our Lord” but on at least one occasion, President Thomas Jefferson took the date even further calling it “in the year of our Lord Christ“. ( http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=22345 )
Have you walked through Jefferson’s Memorial and read his quotes or any of his writings? Quite often he refers to “Almighty God,” “the God who gave us life gave us liberty,” “God is just,” etc… He even refers to “the holy author of our religion.” If not Christianity, what religion was “our religion” as he referred to it? ( http://www.monticello.org/reports/quotes/memorial.html )
I could go on and on. I’ve been down this road before, done the research before. Liberals have latched onto the “separation of church and state” idea and whitewashed American history, striving hard to use Jefferson’s statement to fit their own purposes. Those purposes are flawed. When analyzing the content and context around that Danbury letter along with Jefferson’s other writing, it is quite clear that the common understood purpose of “separation between church and state” is virtually opposite Jefferson’s original intent.
For a man that supposedly believed the government should refrain from mentioning God and religion, he certainly mentioned it in his public and private capacities quite a lot.
OH BARRY, I forgot one more thing I had been meaning to add. Want to know what was on the front of Jefferson’s bible? “I am a real Christian, that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus. I have little doubt that our whole country will soon be rallied to the unity of our Creator. ” ( http://www.racematters.org/americarootedinchristianity.htm & http://www.errantskeptics.org/Quotes_by_Presidents.htm )
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Benn busy tonight John. I’ll get to your response later. Cheers.
“Barry, if “everything you’ve read” led you to believe that Jefferson wanted God out of our government, then what you’ve read has been very selective indeed.”
Excuse me? I was responding to your comment that Thomas Jefferson “believed our nation was a Christian nation and our government should reflect such.” I have no doubt that Jefferson believed in some notion of God (by most accounts, he was a Deist), but that’s a far cry from saying he believed that America was a “Christian” nation.
And I apologize for the lack of a citation. I can’t figure out how to get HMTL to work on this message board, but here’s the URL: http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/farrell_till/myth.html.
So Barry, When Jefferson writes on his Bible that he is a Christian and “disciple of the doctrines of Jesus”… when he dates a document as President “in the year of our Lord Christ”.. and at other times talks about the “God who gave US life gave US liberty” and the “holy author of OUR religion” what religion do you think he was referring to?
The “US” and the “OUR” means he is included himself in the religion of the people. And since he has stated he is Christian, then it is clear he believed we are a Christian people.
Since he clearly had no quarrel referring to God and Christ on government documents, the Declaration and speeches… and believed we are a Christian people… then the left-wing notion that he was a strong supporter of removing God and prayer from all government activities is lunacy.
John,
First of all, I don’t see a political agenda in Pastor Wright’s prayer. Democrats love to drive around with bumper stickers that say “God is not a Republican” or “Jesus isn’t a Republican” etc… so let’s not say Paster Wright’s Christian beliefs and prayer represents a political agenda. Christians might be more prone to be Republicans, but there is no evidence that the Pastor’s beliefs represent his political agenda or affiliation.
The United States is a Christian Nation. Always has been, always shall be. The Declaration of Independence declares our rights are endowed by God, and states our reliance on “the protection of divine Providence.” The first General Order from President George Washington, issued AFTER the Declaration of Independence, included the line “The General hopes and trusts that every officer and man will endeavor to live and act as becomes a Christian soldier defending the dearest rights and liberties of his country.” President Abraham Lincoln used President Washington’s order as the basis for his own order during the Civil War requiring respect for the Sabbath, calling our nation a “Christian people” with regard for “Divine will” and respect for the “Most High”. Lincoln continues stating that “The first order issued by the Father of his country after the Declaration of Independence, indicates the spirit in which our institutions were founded, and should ever be defended”.
Sounds like Abraham Lincoln is saying our nation was founded as a Christian nation. If you don’t believe me, will you believe him?
With that out of the way, the Wright prayer in no way violates the First Amendment. Freedom of religion is not freedom from religion. As stated earlier, the 1st Amendment prevents the government from establishing a state religion, it does not prevent the exercise of religion. If that prayer was a violation of the 1st Amendment, then so were Washington and Lincoln’s orders as mentioned above. If Wright’s prayer is a violation of the 1st Amendment, than should the Declaration of Independence be voided as it clearly mentions God and relies on Providence?
We are a Christian nation. That means, as the Declaration of Independence states, that our rights are granted by God, not the government. It means that God is above the government, not the other way around (which keeps perfectly with the 1st Amendment). It means our laws were framed around Christian values. You don’t need me to explain this to you, research into the founding of our nation and the how the Declaration of Independence and Constitution were formed, that will make our Christian founding quite clear. The reason this is lost on successive generations is people don’t study this stuff anymore as the left tries to whitewash our history.
In 1782, the Congress approved a resolution which stated “The Congress of the United States recommends and approves the Holy Bible for use in all schools”. Why do that if not a Christian nation?
Those of us who understand that our nation is a Christian nation are not seeking to change our government as you suggest. It is the left who has been seeking to change our government for some time. We understand that there is a direct correlation with our falling away from God and our demise as a nation. We just want to stop the decline and return to that reliance on “divine Providence” which gives our nation strength.
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Besides being irrelevant, what’s the point of this O’Reilly/Judge/Delay rant exactly? Although he’s mostly right about Christmas, O’Reilly is a tool, and I’m no fan of Tom Delay either. We could likely debate for hours about Terry Schaivo’s death and the Ten Commandments, but that really has nothing to do with the argument at hand.
You’re right in that Pastor Wright’s prayer was not a violation of the 1st amendment, he was just an individual exercising his religious beliefs. I got a little carried away in responding and got him muddled in a larger point which is that officially labeling this nation as a Christian Nation is not in line with the 1st amendment and is a point where you and I are not in agreement. Perhaps we can just agree that Christianity has had a strong influence on the framework of our government and that we both hope for a path back to “better days ahead” and we can agree to disagree about some of the causes of the current decline of the US. Cause that’s all I’ve got time for right now.
best,
John
We definitely can agree that Christianity had a strong influence on the framework of our government and we both hope for a path back to better days. Not sure what else we agree on, but that’s a start.